KKC Theory Wiki

The Lay of Sir Savien Traliard Preserves the True Story of Lanre and Lyra

plausible connection · popularity 211 · 1 source thread

The tragic duet of Savien and Aloine is a surviving musical echo of Lanre and Lyra's doomed love story.

About: Arliden's Lanre Song, Lyra

Also involves: Haliax, The Amyr, Skarpi, The Eolian, The Chandrian, Selitos

The theory§

The theory holds that 'The Lay of Sir Savien Traliard', the famously difficult duet Kvothe performs at the Eolian, preserves the true story of Lanre and Lyra beneath a layer of romance. Kvothe describes the song as one of 'love lost, and found, then lost again', which maps onto Skarpi's account in which Lanre died, was drawn back to life by Lyra's power and love, and then lost her when she died. This fits a recurring principle of the world: prose records decay and are rewritten, but songs preserve historical truth, as with the rhyme that catalogues the Chandrian and their signs. Skarpi's maxim that 'there's only one story' supports the convergence, and the song's full title is noted to contain the letters of names like Lanre, Lyra, and Aloine. A complication is that the song calls Savien 'greatest of the Amyr', and the Amyr were founded by Selitos specifically to oppose Lanre/Haliax, so Lanre could not have been an Amyr; the theory proposes instead that Savien was one of the later mortal Amyr, or that the figures are figurative echoes rather than the same people, since the same tragic shape recurs across Jax and the moon, Lanre and Lyra, and Kvothe and Denna.

Evidence§

  • When Kvothe first plays at the Eolian, he mentions it's a story about "love lost, and found, then lost again. At cruel fate, and man's folly".
    OP's anchor: the song's theme maps onto Lanre and Lyra's arc. — u/An_Anonymous_Acc
  • One of the surrounding themes in this book is that stories often lose meaning, but songs don't. For example, the song about the chandrian and their signs.
    Core principle: songs preserve truth that prose loses, like the Chandrian rhyme. — u/An_Anonymous_Acc
  • We know from skarpies story that Lanre died, was revived, and then Lyra died again. And why wouldn't there be a song about the two greatest rulers that ended in tragedy?
    Skarpi's account matches lost-found-lost; motive for such a song to exist. — u/An_Anonymous_Acc
  • As Skarpi said. There's only one story.
    Top comment supports convergence via Skarpi's maxim. — u/daniel_dareus
  • Soon **everyone knew** the story of how Lanre had died, and how his love and Lyra’s power had **drawn him back**.
    Refines theory: Ilien likely based the song on the real Lanre story, like Arliden. — u/Detnoi
  • You can't spell The Lay of Sir Savien Traliard without: Lanre, Lyra, Aethe, Rethe, Aloine, (Savien obviously), Arliden, Netalia.
    Adds wordplay evidence: the title's letters spell the relevant names. — u/OldHolly
  • I thought Skarpi’s story was the Amyr being founded by Selitos to combat Lanre/Haliax. So how could Lanre be part of the Amyr?
    CounterCounter: Amyr opposed Lanre, so he couldn't be Savien 'of the Amyr'. — u/bluelobster3
  • The first theory should be something like, "Savien and Aloine is a retelling of Lanre and Lyra." Actually being the same person is a too big a theory for most things
    CounterCounter/refine: prefers a retelling/echo over literal identity. — u/aerojockey

Book refs: NOTW, WMF

Tier reasoning§

tier verified: thematic mapping is a reasonable fit, plausible

Contributors§

Source threads§