KKC Theory Wiki

The Amyr Used the University as a Base and Imprisoned the Chandrian in the Underthing

plausible connection · popularity 298 · 1 source thread

Three Chandrian signs—blue flame, rotten wood, rusted metal—appear together in the Underthing, hinting at a past Chandrian presence there.

About: The Amyr, The Chandrian, The Underthing

Also involves: The University, Auri, Kvothe

The theory§

This theory reads the Underthing beneath the University as the site of a former Chandrian presence, and proposes the University itself as an ancient Amyr stronghold from which the Chandrian were imprisoned below. Its foundation is the trio of canonical Chandrian signs that Arliden and Abenthy identify early on — blue flame, rotting wood, rusting metal — which appear together at the murder of Kvothe's troupe and which the theory finds echoed in the Underthing: Foxen's blue-green glow, verdigris on copper, mouldering timbers, and a great iron wheel read as the wheel to which Encanis was bound in Trapis's tale. Supporting threads link the windowless, single-entrance Archives to the prison-tower of Taborlin the Great and to the Doors of Stone behind which Iax is said to be sealed, and point to wordplay tying Imre to 'Amyr.' The decisive counter-argument turns on the Chandrian signs being unnatural acceleration of ordinary decay: Denna notes the rusted Trebon pump was new, whereas the Underthing has had 'uncounted centuries' to rot, rust, and crumble of its own accord — and its bricked-up windows directly contradict the sign that brick should crumble in Chandrian presence.

Evidence§

  • Pat keeps emphasising three specific signs of the Chandrian: blue flame, rotten wood, and rusty metal. He establishes this early in the book when Kvothe's father is talking to Abenthy.
    OP's premise: the three canonical Chandrian signs the theory tracks. — u/OutOff
  • the third instance these three signs appear is the most interesting occurrence of these signs in the whole novel - **in the Underthing with Auri**. Instead of laying it on thick though like in the previous two examples, Pat actually tries to obscure them
    Core claim: the three signs reappear, hidden, in the Underthing. — u/OutOff
  • **Rotting wooden** doors hung off **rusted hinges**, and there were half-collapsed rooms filled with moldering tables and chairs. One room had a pair of bricked-up windows
    Textual evidence of rot and rust in the Underthing. — u/OutOff
  • the supposed waterwheel in the Underthing bears a striking resemblance to that on which Tehlu killed Encanis, plus the "canal" in the underthing is quite similar to the giant pit dug by the townspeople.
    Links Underthing wheel and canal to Encanis's prison wheel and pit. — u/OutOff
  • the three pillars are actually made of none other than copper. So at this point I'm pretty certain that this part of the Underthing WAS a Chandrian prison created by the Amyr … it has three COPPER pillars, which Haliax - a master namer - would have no power over.
    Copper pillars as Chandrian-proof prison material, naming the Amyr. — u/OutOff
  • If we consider the archives building itself it is one piece of smooth, hard stone towering five stories tall and has no windows and only one (supposed) way in. … It might be a library now, but it is basically a prison.
    Comment adds: windowless single-entrance Archives is built like a prison. — u/MattyTangle
  • Rusted iron and rotten wood are both natural phenomena; the point with the Chandrian is that these things happen much faster than they naturally would. … Denna points out that the rusted pump was new, whereas the Underthing has had ‘uncounted centuries’ to reach its current state.
    CounterCounter: decay is natural over centuries, not a Chandrian sign. — u/JJBrazman
  • he also mentions that there are bricked-up windows, when bricks are supposed to crumble in the presence of the Chandrian.
    CounterCounter: intact bricked-up windows contradict the brick-crumbles sign. — u/JJBrazman

Book refs: NOTW, NOTW ch 12, NOTW ch 16, NOTW ch 72, NOTW ch 87, WMF

Tier reasoning§

tier verified: signs are canonical and textually anchored but the imprisonment leap keeps it plausible

Contributors§

Source threads§